Surveyor missed holes in our boat

[DBA Forum (B) - Ian Fisher]

Hi

We had our boat surveyed a couple of weeks ago and had a few small patches of welding that were recommended done and a bow thruster tube installed

when we were put back in the water the bow thruster tube leaked due to a small patch of missed welding so we were lifted out again
we were then put back in the water and sent on our way

after a couple of minutes we noticed we were taking on a significant amount of water
the shipyard brought additional pumps and started to rip up the floorboards to find the leak

after narrowing the leak down to a place behind the staircase and establishing the pumps could handle the volume of water they left us to dismantle our staircase/wall panelling to find the leak

we found a hole between two plates and the next day we were lifted out

not wishing a similar thing to happen again and being less than impressed with our shipyard surveyors ability
we have spent the last few days lifting the whole floor and checking for more weak spots

we have found in total 5 small holes all in similar positions (ie where the curved sides which are doubled meet the bottom of the boat)
they seem to be confined to areas where there has been water in the past ie under windows/doors

how far is our surveyor liable for missing these weak spots in the hull?
the first hole was underneath the supports the boat stood on when out ofr the water and we think the weight of the boat may have contributed to opening up the hole

we are trying to get some legal advice today....are we best to go through our insurers for this or speak to someone independantly?

the shipyard are pressuring us to make a decision about whether we patch the boat or double the whole bottom (the cost of doubling seems to be on the high side ) and we are concerned about anything else they may have missed

any advice would be appreciated

[DBA Forum (B) - Andy Soper]

Hello Ian,

Sorry to hear your bad news.

I think you need to talk to Hannah Cash of Yachting Lawyers [phone] and to another surveyor - both Balliol Fowden [phone] and Barrie Morse [phone] are well versed in litigation and expert witness. All three advertise in Blue Flag.

Your insurance company will be very interested in the satisfactory repair and probably will want another survey - by a different one to the 'shipyard surveyor' who seems to have missed a number of issues. The shipyard does not appear to have done an efficient job - but you might find it difficult to change shipyards at this point.

Where is the boat?

[DBA Forum (B) - David Beaumont]

Surveyors only test very small points on the hull, possibly a large number but certainly nowhere near enough to cover every square inch. If the hull is not lined with concrete the hammer impact sound should assist. Ultimately though until such time as commercial airliner level testing is available you are reliant on the skill of the surveyor in knowing the likely weak spots to investigate.

Had you had shot blasting done? Did the boat sit evenly on the supports? Did your boat leak before the survey? Did the surveyor or you inspect the boat for wet spots immediately after removal from the water?

David

[DBA Forum (B) - Ian Fisher]

Hi David thanks for your reply

The boat was bone dry inside when we lifted her out..she was pressure washed and surveyed ....there is no concrete ballast and we have removed the majority of the floorboards to make inspecting the hull from inside easier

the hole was underneath one of the supports and we suspect it was missed because of this and also having the weight of the boat concentrated on this area contributed to opening up the hole

[DBA Forum (B) - Charles Fitzhardinge]

If, as you say, the hull was bone dry inside when lifted out, it seems she was watertight then and that subsequent events caused her to leak.
Thus it seems more likely that any blame is likely to rest with the shipyard rather than the surveyor.
Last year, on her 100th birthday, our Anna Maria was lifted out in Harlingen, surveyed, then had some works done, some of which involved very heavy water blasting and some needle-gun work to remove badly done 2 pot epoxy painting done (7 years previously, by others).
We had had some water in our bilge (which had been a persistent, though easily manageable problem following a brief grounding on the German Moselle a year or so before). Following our lift-out we noted a very slow leak from our not-yet emptied bilge (a drip every several seconds, but measurement of the collected water showed adding up to a significant volume entering the bilge each month). This was included by our surveyor (OUR appointee, not the shipyard's) in his report.
Obviously a surveyor can only base his report on careful visual assessment and random testing, so the report is only an expert opinion, not a watertight (sorry!) guarantee.
In our case we set off from Harlingen only to find, 2 days later on reaching Lemmer, that there was water covering the engine-room floor! Thankful that we had not set out, as we had intended, to cross the Ijsellmeer, we turned tail for Harlingen with pumps working hard.
During this return trip I carefully inspected the inside of the hull while my wife drove and found water mysteriously entering from the rudder-stock, at a point 1m above canal level! Experimentation showed that with the engine running at less than 1200rpm there was no water entering. At 1200rpm there was a trickle, and at 1400 or more, Niagra Falls. We therefore pressed on with reduced haste.
The works had included fitting of a new 4 bladed prop with greater pitch than the old 3 blader an d I wondered if this had contributed to the new problem.
On lifting out we found a very small (less than 5 mm diameter) hole pretty well hidden just aft of the propeller. When water was forced by hose into a hole drilled into the rudder stock water flowed from the hidden hole. This was soon welded up and repainted, and we have had no problem since.
We can only assume either this hole was the result of the high pressure water blasting, perhaps removing some ancient rust, or that the hole had been there "for ever", and that until the new propeller (which increased our boat speed at 1200rpm from about 6kph to over 8kph) there had never been enough "pressure" behind the prop to lift the water the necessary 1m above the waterline.
Either way, we felt it was 'one-of-those-things" and that neither Surveyor nor shipyard could be proven guilty.
Charles Fitzhardinge
De Vrouwe Anna Maria